Don't forget "brazen conduct". A new cover-all for whatever they have against you.
And also having a person of the opposite sex sleep at your house.
Not screaming loud enough when being raped.
Julia Orwell
JoinedPosts by Julia Orwell
-
22
How many things can a JW get disfellowshipped for?
by digderidoo inhow many is there?
can we have a brain storm and get a list going?.
paul.
-
-
-
8
Interview with an Apostate: AllTimeJeff
by AllTimeJeff intell us a little about yourself and your family.. i was born to jw parents.
which is ok, i haven't actually tried to make new friends.
this is actually a really big deal in my life and one i have been working through.
-
-
Julia Orwell
Yes, I've read your story before, but I liked this interview because you give more pieces of the puzzle that is you. I'm so glad you could move on with your life after such a horrible JW experience for 30 years.
-
18
Missed another meeting
by DS211 inwell ive missed my 5th meeting in a row..decided to watch football/soccer instead.
wife has also missed 4 in a row...still havent discussed ttatt
-
-
Julia Orwell
That's how it started with my husband too: he just decided to miss meetings and do something else instead. Now he has a beard! Not that I think your wife should grow one...
-
22
Interview with an Apostate: Julia Orwell
by Julia Orwell intell us a little about yourself and your family.. i have a husband and we've been married nearly three years.
no kids.. were you a born in or a convert?.
convert- converted from atheism in my teens.. are your parents / family jws?.
-
-
Julia Orwell
Tell us a little about yourself and your family.
I have a husband and we've been married nearly three years. No kids.
Were you a born in or a convert?
Convert- converted from atheism in my teens.
Are your parents / family JWs?
NO thank goodness!!
How many generations have been JWs?
None.
Did you hold any position in the WTS? (MS, Elder etc...)
Hell no, I was just a 'sister'. No dick=no chance.
Did you *really* believe in the bible, in spirits (angels, demons)?
As a JW yes I did. That's why I became a JW. Of course as the years went on I had doubts, but I believed what it said in the Bible.
Did you get baptised? When and why?
Yes. In 2000 at the age of 19. Why? Because I really thought it was the truth and wanted to dedicate my life to 'Jehovah'.
What was the initial trigger that made you start questioning things?
It's hard to really say. I questioned things the whole time I was in, and maintained a dual set of beliefs like 'doublethink.' What really got me thinking on it was evidence that the holy spirit wasn't directing things because it was always changing, and the growing emphasis on thoughtless obedience, and noticing that the strawman version of the 'world' constructed by the org was more and more wrong the more I actually looked at the world around me. There were other things, cognitive dissonnance to the extreme. I began to see the logical flaws in their arguments and one day I realised JWs have a double standard: JW does something bad= human imperfection; non-JW does something bad= proof they are under Satan's control or in false religion or 'worldly' and 'need the truth'. I also could never, the whole time I was a JW, reconcile that my kind, generous and loving (albeit imperfect) family would be killed by God because their lives' journeys had led them to another set of beliefs.
I also noticed the literature became a lot more and more about the Org and Obedience. There was a propo film from JW.org about the relief effort for some hurricane in the USA and the very last thing after about 10 minutes of documentary was a man saying, "I'm so grateful to the Organisation, and so grateful to be a part of it..." to that effect. It struck me as pure propaganda like, "Let us thank Comrade Stalin for our wonderful life!"
I was buying books one day online, and decided to see if there were any books about JWs, so I did a search, which came with, "Reasoning from the Scriptures with JWs' and I thought, "What! JWs follow the bible perfectly so how could anyone use it to reason against us?" The author was an ex JW who read Rom 4-5 and woke up. I did the same and found that JWs have the whole works thing wrong.
Now having doubts and wanting to nut out my own salvation and what the Bible really said, I bought a King James version and started taking notes as I read the gospels. And then, it all fell into place for me. It all fell into place that Jesus' message was very different to what JWs teach, and so I did some more looking. And for the last few years, I've been into books about North Korea and Stalin and FLDS cults and they were all so familiar to me...my subconscious had been seeking out books about totalitarianism and experiences from totalitarian regimes because I was living under one without knowing it. My mental awakening was a very complex, multi-nuanced thing.
Where did you find information? Internet sites? Books?
This site I stumbled upon when I doubted something historical in the WT and decided to google it. First results: JWN. I read the topic, which was about the number of christians in the first century, then had a poke around at the other topics. I thought, "Haters gonna Hate." But it stuck with me. Then Wikipedia. Then JWSurvey and JWfacts.
How difficult or painful was the process of leaving?
Not that difficult as I had my family's support. It was a real slap in the face though to have so many people I thought were my friends turn on me or shun me. Getting hounded at the beginning was very painful and stressful because I was in a very fragile mental state. Now I just smile and wave.
Was it a big dramatic exit or a careful quiet fade?
A semi-planned fade that went very quickly and resulted in an inquisition in which I talked my way out of the charge of 'apostasy' and then just got so stressed out about the whole meetings thing and stopped going after a meltdown I had at the memorial this year.
Did you convince anyone else to leave with you?
My husband. It didn't take him long to enter a state of confusion over the matter, then throw his lot in with me. When he saw how badly I was being treated even by 'friends', I think he put two and two together.
How were your family relations affected by your decision?
They were affected for the better! I have far more in common now with my parents and brother, have reconnected with cousins, and can now enjoy family occasions like birthdays for the first time since I was a teenager. I can now be completely honest with the family, rather than having to perform the complex mental gymnastics you need to as a JW to put a positive face on the cult to family member.
Were you or are you still being shunned by those who didn't leave?
For the most part, yes, though I never run into them anymore. The same ones come to our door when doing the territory and are always friendly, but most have dropped me off Facebook and I just never see them anyway. Anyone who actively shuns me can bite my shiny metal ass.
How long have you now been out?
Since March this year.
Was there anything you looked forward to doing when you left?
Heck yes: study, write, develop my art, keep more birds, read Lord of the Rings again, drink wine on 'meeting' nights, say "Lest We Forget" on ANZAC day, sleep in on weekends with my husband and the general joy of knowing I don't have to be here, there and everywhere, and sing the anthem...what a debauched little apostate I am.
What are you most proud of achieving since you left?
It's been too short a time to have really achieved much, but I'd say my biggest achievement is halving my antidepressant dosage in the short time after I left JWs. Also, I'm starting to sell my artworks! I don't get much for them, but it's a start.
Is there anything you miss about life in the congregation?
I miss the social aspects of it, that you could walk in and there was always someone to talk to.
Red pill or blue pill? Do you regret waking up to reality at all?
I do not regret waking up to reality. I'm relieved to have done so. Somehow, reality never left me, and my non-JW family kept me somewhat grounded. Reality never left me, but I left it for a while there.
Did you become an atheist or transfer your faith elsewhere?
I'm not a full believer yet I'm not a total atheist. My faith is myself and that humanity seems to be progressing into a more civilised state. Historically speaking, we are living at a time of more civil rights, educational opportunities, and medical knowledge than ever before. I try to look for the good in people, but am also happy to tell them to bite my shiny metal ass.
How do you now feel about religion in general?
I feel when it is used to bring communities together and bring out the best in people, such as those who dedicate their time to charity out of a religious feeling, then it can be a force for good. Where it forms part of a society's heritage and therefore gives meaning to its adherents, it is an integral part of how humans express themselve. However, when it exploits people, allows power hungry despots to oppress people, is used as a justification for violence or murder, takes away people's abilities to think, becomes a force for intolerance and judgement, then it's a terrible thing. I think all of these things, good and bad, will always be with humanity, but there are some religions who do try to do no harm to others and help the community. The world in which we live is becoming increasingly intolerant of injustice, so unjust religious practices will continue to come under attack.
Do you feel any guilt celebrating xmas or birthdays or doing any other JW "no-no"s?
I do. Not sure why. Probably because of over a decade of habit, and that no one forced me not to celebrate, I imposed it on myself when I became a JW. So I have no one to blame for my idiocy over these things but myself.
Have you attended any face-to-face meetups of ex-JWs?
No. If there were one here where I live, I'd be there though.
Describe your circle of friends - mostly other ex-JWs or regular people?
I don't have enough to make a circle: a 'conscious' JW, a friend from Uni I've had for over a decade who was never a JW, and a lady I met through my quail breeding business are pretty much the only friends I speak to outside of my family. I have a lot of people I talk to on Facebook of various stripes too, from a convicted felon from the USA to the never-a-jw vegan daughter of my former JW best friend.
Do you tell people about your JW past?
Heck yes. Everyone needs to know what a destructive cult it is.
Do you feel animosity or pity toward current JWs?
Pity for them as a whole, and animosity towards certain ones I know. I also HATE the org, and realised that I'd hated it deep down for a long time before consciously realising it.
How do you respond to witnesses when they call at your door?
They all know my house since I faded quite regularly. I'm always polite and engage in small talk, but don't respond to 'encouragement' to return. I just gloss it over and ask about non-JW things like work and family. Then I offer to show them my birds. Everyone loves to see the birds.
Storm the barricades or tend to the wounded? (do you favor activism or support)
Tend the wounded, though I will storm the barricades if I have the energy.
What do you think is the most effective approach to reaching people still in?
I have no idea. If you know, please tell me.
Do you think the WTS can or should be destroyed, will continue on as-is or grow / change?
I think eventually it will decline as more and more information becomes available and more people have access to it. It will be relegated to an historical curiosity like so many other cults and groups.
How has your life been impacted by your JW past?
My BS meter is so finely tuned I'm almost sceptical. I have mental illness. It's been hard to get my confidence in myself back. I have nightmares. I have very few friends, down from hundreds.
On the good side, I don't swear, lie or steal like I did before I was a JW. I'm much more respectful of people and authority. I dealt with my anger management issues, and today I'm still pretty chilled.
The best thing though, I still have the man I met at the kingdom hall!
Are there things in your life you blame the WTS for?
Yes. The fact that I'm not a published writer or have a career. Also my depression. And my lack of confidence. My father always told me the world was my oyster but it's become my off bucket of prawns because I wasted my time and energy on a @#%$$# cult instead of developing my creative and intellectual abilities.
JW upbringing - a protection or a curse?
Can't say personally, but probably a curse for the kid.
How do you fill your time now it's not filled with meetings and field service?
Typing on JWN, developing my art, hanging with my folks, online study, exercise, reading more...
Do you still have an interest in JW beliefs and doctrines?
I want to keep up to date with it because someone once said "It is well to know what tune the devil is playing". That and, it has freakshow appeal.
How much of your time is still spent on JW related matters?
Just here on JWN.
What do you think of the ex-JW community?
Same as anyone really. They do tend to be a lot more sceptical and informed, which makes them great to talk to. I also am very grateful to them for the support they've given me through the hard fading times.
Do you see yourself still being associated with the ex-JW community in 5 or 10 years time?
Yep.
Do you fear the future?
Hell no.
What advice would you give to anyone starting the journey of leaving the WTS?
Leave on your own terms. Do as much research on cults and cult techniques as you can. Do some independent research on JWs and the Bible.
What would you change in your life if you could go back and talk to yourself?
I was 19 and stupid so I wouldn't have listened to myself, but if I did, I'd say to do independent research.
Do you have any regrets about life since you left?
NOPE
Can we read your life-story anywhere? (links to online or books
Bits and pieces on JWN. One day I'll write a book or series of short stories.
Want to share your own story? Please use the Interview with an Apostate: Template and post it in the Personal Experiences & Reunions section with the title "Interview with an Apostate: [your name or alias]"
-
34
Interview with an Apostate: Simon
by Simon ini had an idea for coming up with a standard(ish) set of interview questions which members of the ex-jw community could use to provide insights into their lives as a kind of series (yeah, i was thinking of "interview with a vampire", lol).. anyway, this is the result to show the sort of thing i'm thinking of (applied to myself) and i'd like feedback on the format and the questions as well as who you'd also like to see "interviewed".. feel free to provide your own life story as a separate topic or ask any additional questions that i've missed.
it's not meant to be rigid so questions / themes can be adapted as needed and split / joined as appropriate.
the common questions will hopefully apply to everyone for some consistency and to guide the writing process with additional questions asked that make sense to each subject.. well, here goes .... tell us a little about yourself and your family.. im an independent software developer who grew up in manchester (uk) but now lives in calgary (canada) with my wife angharad and two boys, liam and dylan.
-
-
Julia Orwell
@ Fernando, I'm a HUGE fan of all George Orwell's works and am thus very familiar with 1984. I can't say I liked the Matrix though as I didn't even remember the pill reference came from it til you said it then.
-
19
Interview with an apostate: Confused and Alone
by confusedandalone intell us a little about yourself and your family.. i am 36 years old and married with 2 children under the age of ten.
i am waiting for my letter of da situation to be completed.
my wife is also done with the watchtower organization and plans to make things official on the 3 rd of january.. are your parents / family jws?.
-
-
Julia Orwell
Thanks CAA, your work is great as usual. You are an inspiration.
-
27
Finally getting a shepherding call... or so I thought
by Zoos ina few weeks ago i got a visit from a sister from the old congregation.
she was our uber pioneer, fearless, regular and often accompanied by her husband, a ministerial servant.
she didnt know i lived here so it was a brief visit after she found out i had disassociated myself.. i got a knock at the door a few minutes ago and it was her husband this time.
-
-
Julia Orwell
I'm so happy for him that he has you for support. That's great!
-
6
Simple life at bethel
by KSFernando intoday watchtower study encourage simple life for pionears.
i am live in a asian country.
the bethel provide luxury facilities for their bethel family.
-
-
Julia Orwell
$75 a month might sound like a lot if you're in a South East Asian country, but where I live it is the price of food for a week for an adult, if the adult eats cheaply. I know in some parts of Asia that is a lot of money. So while you pioneers in SE Asia live in your tiny bamboo houses with no electricity or water, the Asian bethelites live like kings! In reality, the WT Society could afford to give all Asian JWs houses, education and healthcare.
I know bethelites who served in Yangon and visited Yangon Bethel twice, and saw how the people lived in the delta area and upcountry. The contrast was unbelievable, but the bethelites still didn't have as good conditions as non-bethelites in Australia, my country.
-
64
Be honest. Am I an abusive Father??
by DATA-DOG ini was angry with my kid for questioning me.
i work, i pay the bills, i provide food, clothing and shelter for them.
instead of respect, i get attitude.
-
-
Julia Orwell
Hey, [ blank ]. When you start thinking that you have a valid complaint, just remember this, YOU are a speck of dirt. Who are you to complain about ANYTHING! What do you have to be proud of? Go stand in the corner, and think about that for awhile!"
DD
I think you were ok to say that. Sometimes they need to know the world doesn't revolve around them. But I would also find opportunities to praise good behaviour or when they do something you want them to do. Bouquets and carrots are sometimes needed rather than just bricks and sticks.
-
51
New Handbill Campaign
by NoRegrets inapparently the jws are doing a new handbill campaign.
they were just at my door and offered it to me with one of their heartless and scripted presentations.
the religion has just become so dumbed down.
-
-
Julia Orwell
Oh great, that means they're going to start the territory again and I'm going to have them come again. The only one who actually comes to my door is an elder who looks like Santa Clause. The others walk past and scowl. And I'm not even dfd or da'd.